WEBVTT

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Professor Donald
Kagan: Peisistratus died in

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527 with all his power,
insofar as we know peacefully,

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and was succeeded in the
tyranny over Athens by his sons,

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by first wife,
Hippeis who was the elder and

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Hipparchus.
I think it's proper to think of

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Hippeis as the man in charge,
but Hipparchus shared

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considerable amount of his power
and responsibility.

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At first it appears that they
ruled in the same way that their

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father had, which was to say one
that was moderate and didn't

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cause a great deal of opposition
in Athens,

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and, of course,
there always was a certain

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amount of opposition.
We should not forger that.

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Aristocratic families always
vying for their own power and

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their own position were
uncomfortable very often under

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Peisistratus and different ones,
different families got into

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trouble and were driven out,
and our old friends the

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Alcmaeonidae got into trouble
again,

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were banished in the time of
the sons of Peisistratus,

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and it was necessary to have a
battle against them,

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in which they were defeated and
driven out.

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That will play a
significant role in the future

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of Athens quite soon.
But I think it's in the year

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514 that a very important event
changes the course of things.

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There is a personal quarrel
between the tyrants,

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one of the tyrants actually,
and one of the noble young men,

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which results in a plot to kill
both Hippeis and Hipparchus,

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led by two young men who will
become known in Athenian lore as

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the tyrannicides,
because in their plot they

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succeed in killing the younger
brother Hipparchus,

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although they don't get Hippeis.
They themselves are killed and

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the plot fails,
but its significance,

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I think,
comes in the fact that it made

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Hippeis thereafter very nervous,
very concerned about his safety

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and about the future of his
regime,

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and the nature of the regime
according to tradition changes

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and it becomes very harsh,
and there are persecutions of

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people, who are suspected of
perhaps plotting or hoping to

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plot against the tyranny,
and that's significant.

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It's a characteristic
event, as I told you early on as

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I spoke about tyranny in
general;

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usually in the second and
sometimes if they made it to the

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third, there would be
opposition.

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The opposition would make the
rulers nervous,

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the nervous rulers would then
misbehave and create further

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opposition and that's the story
as it happens in Athens.

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One wrinkle in the Athenian
story is that the Alcmaeonidae,

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who had been expelled from the
city,

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always active,
always thinking,

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got into a position of a
special favor to the Delphic

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Oracle,
when there was an earthquake

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that badly damaged the temple of
Apollo at Delphi.

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The Alcmaeonidae bid for the
contract to rebuild the temple,

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and in the doing of that,
they spent some of their own

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money to make the temple even
more beautiful than the contract

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required,
which put them in great favor

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with the priests of Delphi,
and they immediately cashed

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this favor in,
in the form of seeking their

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own political advantage.The
story, as Herodotus tells it,

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is that their goal was to drive
out Hippeis from Athens and the

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way to do it this time--you
remember they've tried every

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trick in the world,
and it hasn't really worked.

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The idea now was to turn to the
most powerful military state in

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Greece and use it for their
purposes.

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I'm talking of course about
Sparta.

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The tale is that whenever the
Spartans sent a message to the

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Delphic Oracle asking for the
opportunity to consult the

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Oracle,
the answer that came back was:

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first free the Athenians.
Well, whether that was the

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reason or he had reasons of his
own, the very ambitious King of

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Sparta,
King Cleomenes was to undertake

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the job of removing Hippeis from
power in Athens quite soon.

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It's in the year 511-10 that
the Spartans under Cleomenes

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will invade Attica,
gain control of the state,

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and remove Hippeis and
withdraw.

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But I'll come back to that
story in just a moment.

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Let me conclude our
consideration of the Athenian

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tyranny by looking at what were
the achievements and

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consequences of the years of
tyrannical rule--many positive

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elements,
as was so often the case with

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tyranny.
From the economic side this was

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a period of great expansion of
Athenian commerce,

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trade, very strong to the east
through the Hellespont and to

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the Black Sea,
but also in this period Athens

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trades very strongly with the
West.

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I mean to say chiefly Sicily
and Italy, and in fact up to

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that point, up to those years
roughly speaking,

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Corinthian pottery,
fine Corinthian pottery,

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is dominant in the western
areas and this is no surprise.

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That's always been the case for
Corinth.

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But by the end of the sixth
century, Athenian pottery has

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actually outstripped it in the
western markets,

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which show you how much this
combination of trade and

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industry was changing the
character of Athens and making

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it wealthier and bringing along
various elements of change in

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their way of life.
Another consequence of the

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tyrannical experience in Athens
was a diminution in the power of

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the aristocracy,
and this again is the general

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story wherever we see tyranny in
the Greek world.

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It never erases aristocracy;
you never see the disappearance

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of the distinction between
nobles and commoners,

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and claims to the aristocracy
of birth and descent from the

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gods.
It is always there.

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Even in the most democratic of
Greeks states,

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like Athens for instance,
aristocracy doesn't go away.

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It's not abolished;
it lives side by side with a

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democratic constitution.
But the domination by the

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aristocracy, the monopoly of all
the powers and influence that

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they used to have,
it's not there and that is a

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tremendously important
consequence.

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So, when the tyranny goes away
and it's necessary to

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reconstruct a new Athenian
constitution,

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the answer will not simply be
to return to the old days before

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the tyrants.
Solon had intervened in an

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important way and the tyrants
had made their contribution too,

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to changes that turned out to
be permanent.

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It's also true that under the
tyrants, the local power of the

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noblemen had been reduced and
the power of the government in

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Athens,
which was not dominated by the

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aristocracy, but by the
tyrants--that was a trend and

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one of the issues that would
have to be worked out would be

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what would be the relationship
between the localities outside

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of Athens and the city itself.
Localism has been damaged but

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not abolished.
If there are going to be

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new forms of government that
take place, one of the

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consequences,
one of the precursors of that

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will be to further strengthen
the center and weaken the

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periphery,
and to continue to strip as

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best one could the influence and
power of the aristocracy,

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which was mainly to be felt in
the countryside and to increase

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the power of some other form of
government,

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which center would be in Athens.
On the other hand,

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because of the reforms of
Solon, which I remind you

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Peisistratus and his sons
allowed to stay in place,

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at least in the formal
sense--therefore every year,

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think about it,
people were elected

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archon,
people where chosen for a

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council, law courts operated,
all of these things not

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dominated by the aristocracy,
but really, in the case of the

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magistracies,
wealth was the criterion.

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Remember ever since Solon
that people who were not

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aristocrats, but were wealthy
also participated in those jobs,

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and the council which was open
to three out of the four

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Athenian classes under Solon,
meant that people actually went

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to the council chamber,
participated in decisions about

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what was going on.
To be sure they weren't going

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to do anything that the tyrants
didn't want, but ninety to

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ninety five percent of the time,
maybe more, the tyrant didn't

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care, so that they were
getting--this is the point I

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really want to stress.
They were getting experience in

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the business of self government.
When you do that,

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I think the history of the
world shows that once people

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have risen to that state,
where they do participate in

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their own self government,
it's very hard to get them back

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into a state when they don't
anymore.

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That's going to be very
difficult to make stick.

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Athens has been moved down
the road to self government as a

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consequence, strangely enough,
of the tyranny.

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Just in passing,
I might point out that's not a

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unique phenomenon.
It's very interesting to look

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back at the early post-colonial
age in the twentieth century and

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to see that there were real
differences between colonies

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that had been ruled in a--I
don't want to say tyrannical,

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but in an absolute way,
such as the Congo or other

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places like that,
as opposed to places that had

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achieved some degree of self
government,

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even while they were ruled by
European power,

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the difference was very great.
The same experience that I am

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talking about now that lead to
the capacity and a determination

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to govern oneself was more
likely in places where there had

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been some such thing.
India, of course,

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is a striking example.
Where the Indians had managed

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to achieve some degree of
participation in the government

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of their own state under the
British,

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who in spite of all the
troubles they had,

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have actually produced a
functioning relatively

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democratic government in that
great subcontinent.

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Well, that's the sort of thing
I'm talking about.

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So, knowing what we now
know, looking backward,

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it's possible to say that it
looks like the tyranny played a

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very important role in the
transition from aristocratic

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government to democracy.
That's not what the tyrants

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intended.
They intended to rule for as

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long as they could,
but it was one of the

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consequences as we will see.
Well, let's turn once again to

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those Alcmaeonidae who had,
as you remember a checkered

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past in Athens and even under
the tyranny,

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because they had been driven
out.

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Remember Megacles had his deal
with Peisistratus,

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and how Peisistratus had broken
that deal, so he went into

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opposition.
He and the Alcmaeonidae were

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driven out, but they came back,
because we find Cleisthenes

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name on the list of archons,
but then they had been driven

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out again.
In the year 511-10,

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Cleisthenes who was leader of
the Alcmaeonidae family,

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and political faction was in
exile and was working to get the

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Spartans to do the job that was
done.

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So Cleomenes takes his Spartan
army in 510, he drives out the

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tyrants, and then he goes home.
Now, the question that

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confronts the Athenians is what
form of government should we

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have?
Again, there's a whole range of

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possibilities.
Not a whole range,

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there are a few possibilities.
One would be reactionary.

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Let's go back to the days
before Solon when the

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aristocracy was everything.
There's certainly,

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as we will see where people who
wanted to do something very much

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like that.
On the other hand,

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what are you going to do about
all these people of consequence

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who are wealthy and who have
made it to the top,

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but who were not aristocrats?
Then what are you going to do

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about all of these family
farmers of whom there must be

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more now than ever because of my
suggestion that Peisistratus had

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taken away land from some exiled
aristocrats and distributed

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among families,
some of whom were successful on

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farms and became hoplite
soldiers and independent

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farmers.
They're not going to enjoy

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being put back to a position
which was worse than they had

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under the tyranny.
Because under the tyranny they

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were sitting on councils,
and participating in these

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things,
sitting in courts and now all

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this was going to be taken away,
if the reactionary aristocracy

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had its way.
That was really what the

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contest was, I think.
Should we continue with the

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Solonian Constitution only
without tyrants or should we go

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back to an aristocracy?
The contest for how to decide

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that was done in the usual old
fashioned way.

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That is to say,
in the contest for the

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archonship.
The candidates of holding one

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view ran against candidates
holding the other view and

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that's where the matter would be
decided.

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But they went at it in the old
way that is the decisions were

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being made in the political
clubs that belonged to the

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aristocracy.
In other words,

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how we're going to do this was
being fought out among the

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aristocrats, not among the
public at large.

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In that contest Cleisthenes who
stood for the more moderate,

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for the Solonian,
let us say, approach as his

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family had always done,
lost.

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The winner was a man called
Isagoras, an aristocrat.

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They were all aristocrats,
of course, and he engages--I

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should say that this election
takes place after preliminary

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pushing back and forth in the
year 508-7 and his victory means

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a victory for the reactionary
program.

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One of his first actions is to
establish still another council,

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not the council of four hundred
that Solon had established,

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but a new council of three
hundred, and it was only made up

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only of aristocrats.
Second, very interesting and it

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turns out to be a very important
change--introduced by Isagoras

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was to scrutinize the citizen's
lists and then to remove from

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that list lots and lots of
people who were deemed to be,

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I guess those who were
illegally enrolled in the

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citizen list.
They were now going to

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impose retroactively the
traditional criterion for

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Athenian citizenship.
Is your father an Athenian

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citizen?
But we know that Solon had

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already broken through that by
permitting people to come to

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Athens and to acquire
citizenship,

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if they had the necessary
skills and there surely had been

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a fair number of those,
and we are told,

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that the Peisistratids had done
the same thing for pretty much

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the same reason.
So, over a couple of

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generations you had foreigners
coming to Athens and acquiring

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Athenian citizenship and
undoubtedly using it,

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who are now going to be
disenfranchised and driven from

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the citizen lists.
Now, that made for quite a

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few discontented people in
Athens.

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If you picked a moment after
which Isagoras has accomplished

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these two things,
that is establishing the

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council of 300,
which is obviously going to be

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the governing body in Athens,
an aristocratic council,

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and driven "X" number of people
from the citizen lists,

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then all of those people are
going to be very unhappy,

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and very likely they have
friends who are also going to be

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unhappy.
So, you have a situation which

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is by now means calm and
settled, but it might have

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settled down as people,
as they usually do when things

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are unavoidable,
when there is no real option.

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Nobody's making a different
case;

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they would have just gotten
used to things,

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I suppose.
But now Cleisthenes decides to

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do things different.
He does not accept his defeat

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as he would have had to do in
the old days,

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having been defeated in the
aristocratic contest.

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Instead,
in the words of Herodotus,

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prohetaerizetai ton
demon, he brought the people

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into his political faction.
The root of that first word,

19:27.404 --> 19:31.314
prosetaerizetai,
is hetaera, which means a club,

19:31.309 --> 19:34.779
a political club,
a collection of companions.

19:34.779 --> 19:38.499
That's the name for these
aristocratic societies and

19:38.501 --> 19:42.121
Cleisthenes broke the rules.
He went out there beyond the

19:42.124 --> 19:44.434
aristocratic circle and he
recruited people.

19:44.430 --> 19:47.800
You become part of my political
faction.

19:47.800 --> 19:52.130
Well, why should they?
Because he had a program that

19:52.125 --> 19:56.785
was contrary to the one pursued
by Isagoras.

20:00.140 --> 20:05.260
It's one that will result,
when it is successful in the

20:05.258 --> 20:11.228
establishment of what everybody
pretty much agrees was the first

20:11.229 --> 20:15.159
Athenian democracy.
The reforms that he

20:15.155 --> 20:19.405
proposed then--we have to
imagine he actually went around

20:19.406 --> 20:23.766
and electioneered.
That was not done before that,

20:23.774 --> 20:28.494
and persuaded people to support
him in his programs,

20:28.490 --> 20:32.190
and then he put his programs
through.

20:32.190 --> 20:34.780
Well, where did he put these
programs through?

20:34.779 --> 20:38.619
He surely couldn't have done
that in a council of 300;

20:38.619 --> 20:41.759
it would never have passed,
and I'm sure he didn't try.

20:41.759 --> 20:44.999
Instead, he acted,
I think, as though there was no

20:45.003 --> 20:48.393
council of three hundred.
He did what you would have

20:48.389 --> 20:51.649
done, if you wanted to propose a
bill prior to that.

20:51.650 --> 20:56.580
You would go to the assembly,
whichwas the Solonian assembly,

20:56.576 --> 20:59.446
which had the right to pass
laws.

20:59.450 --> 21:03.060
No doubt, it only passed laws
that the Peisistratids wanted,

21:03.062 --> 21:06.612
but it was not something new.
It was something people were

21:06.613 --> 21:10.223
accustomed to and he went to the
assembly, and he proposed his

21:10.217 --> 21:13.467
laws and they were passed.
Well, Isagoras still had

21:13.471 --> 21:16.001
the whip hand and he wasn't
going to sit still,

21:16.003 --> 21:21.133
while that took place,
and so using the force at his

21:21.132 --> 21:26.312
disposal he drove,
which was that of King

21:26.308 --> 21:31.948
Cleomenes and the Spartans,
who came back again when called

21:31.949 --> 21:34.609
back.
No doubt, what Cleomenes had in

21:34.608 --> 21:38.048
mind when he did what he had
done originally,

21:38.049 --> 21:40.439
that is, driving out the
Peisistratids,

21:40.438 --> 21:44.078
was the establishment of an
aristocratic republic in Athens

21:44.084 --> 21:46.414
with his friends being in
charge.

21:46.410 --> 21:49.910
That's what the Spartans
typically would do if they

21:49.910 --> 21:52.640
could.
So, he was shocked and annoyed,

21:52.644 --> 21:55.594
I'm certain,
when he hears his friends have

21:55.590 --> 21:59.940
been somehow pushed out of power
and some new fangled kind of a

21:59.939 --> 22:03.869
government that lets ordinary
people participate has been

22:03.867 --> 22:06.837
instituted.
So, Cleomenes comes back with

22:06.842 --> 22:09.442
his forces and drives
Cleisthenes, and we are

22:09.439 --> 22:13.039
told--this is interesting figure
and I can't promise that it's

22:13.040 --> 22:16.360
right,
but it does show up in

22:16.356 --> 22:21.296
Herodotus.
Cleisthenes and seven hundred

22:21.303 --> 22:28.903
families, who must have been in
his faction, are driven out of

22:28.903 --> 22:32.063
Attica.
But the people are not

22:32.060 --> 22:34.700
ready to take that;
they resist,

22:34.699 --> 22:40.549
and they have numbers on their
side, and they end up shutting

22:40.548 --> 22:45.518
up Cleomenes and his forces,
which are not many.

22:45.519 --> 22:48.499
We're talking about probably
hundreds of soldiers,

22:48.497 --> 22:51.407
no more than that,
and we must imagine that there

22:51.414 --> 22:55.064
are thousands of Athenians out
there who are discontent,

22:55.059 --> 22:59.019
and so they shut Cleomenes up
on the Acropolis where he had

22:59.016 --> 23:01.946
run for safety with Isagoras at
his side,

23:01.950 --> 23:05.330
and finally they cut a deal and
they go home.

23:05.329 --> 23:11.199
And Cleisthenes and his
supporters, whom I think it fair

23:11.203 --> 23:16.883
to start calling democrats,
have taken over the city by

23:16.877 --> 23:20.597
this coup and are ready to go
forward.

23:20.599 --> 23:24.209
Now, this requires that
they establish a new

23:24.213 --> 23:27.603
constitution,
because they're going to have a

23:27.597 --> 23:31.977
regime the like of which no one
had ever seen before.

23:31.980 --> 23:35.520
But in trying to understand
this constitution and it's not

23:35.516 --> 23:38.676
easy--the ancient sources tell
us a lot about it,

23:38.680 --> 23:42.960
but it's not perfectly clear
what's in everybody's mind as

23:42.962 --> 23:46.482
they do what they do.
Motives and purposes are not

23:46.484 --> 23:51.074
clear as you'll see in a moment.
But anyway, what I want you to

23:51.071 --> 23:54.041
fix on is this.
Don't imagine that what's

23:54.040 --> 23:57.410
taking place here is even
anything like the American

23:57.408 --> 24:00.378
Constitutional Convention in
Philadelphia,

24:00.380 --> 24:03.770
where a bunch of delegates have
been selected from here and

24:03.774 --> 24:07.114
there, and they all sit and
argue with each other over the

24:07.109 --> 24:10.269
hot summer and finally come up
with various plans.

24:10.269 --> 24:12.539
It's better,
I think, to think,

24:12.539 --> 24:16.019
if we're using historical
analogies to help us,

24:16.019 --> 24:20.709
as of course there is nothing
better than that to help us.

24:20.710 --> 24:25.550
Think of the French Revolution,
think of the convention where

24:25.545 --> 24:30.055
the sort of the mass of the
people have gained control of

24:30.059 --> 24:33.569
the situation,
after driving the king from his

24:33.573 --> 24:37.373
throne, and after really putting
aside a more aristocratic

24:37.366 --> 24:42.196
council that came before it,
and they sit down with radical

24:42.202 --> 24:46.362
people running around,
ready to kill people.

24:46.359 --> 24:50.019
This is the outfit that's going
to end up killing the king and

24:50.015 --> 24:53.245
his queen, and all the
aristocrats they're going to lay

24:53.251 --> 24:56.371
their hands on.
In other words,

24:56.370 --> 25:03.500
we are in a revolutionary
situation, and there is force

25:03.500 --> 25:09.330
and terror are in the air,
and everybody is fully aware of

25:09.325 --> 25:12.345
the danger of this,
that, and the other thing,

25:12.349 --> 25:16.059
and of some dangers that
probably don't even exist.

25:16.059 --> 25:19.329
We are in a situation that
resembles civil war,

25:19.334 --> 25:22.744
that could be on the brink of a
serious civil war,

25:22.740 --> 25:26.180
and added to that--in other
words, the Athenians,

25:26.176 --> 25:30.186
who will be sitting in the
assembly passing the laws that

25:30.185 --> 25:33.975
produce the constitution that
Cleisthenes favors,

25:33.980 --> 25:40.610
are first of all already afraid
that the local aristocrats will

25:40.612 --> 25:46.552
use force or guile against them.
But on top of that there's been

25:46.553 --> 25:51.163
two Spartan invasions of Attica
in the last couple of years and

25:51.160 --> 25:55.170
there's nothing to stop King
Cleomenes from coming back

25:55.172 --> 25:57.712
again,
because he doesn't like the way

25:57.707 --> 26:00.537
he's been treated.
In fact, I'd go further;

26:00.539 --> 26:03.719
I'd say there's every reason to
fear that that's going to

26:03.719 --> 26:06.169
happen.
Again, that's where the analogy

26:06.170 --> 26:09.740
to the French Revolution works
again, because nothing that

26:09.737 --> 26:13.427
happens in that most radical
period of the French Revolution

26:13.430 --> 26:16.330
is understandable.
If you don't know that,

26:16.334 --> 26:19.964
the French regularly expect
that the kings and emperors of

26:19.964 --> 26:23.784
Europe will be marching against
them with professional armies

26:23.784 --> 26:26.444
very soon,
and their fear is absolutely

26:26.439 --> 26:29.779
justified, and so is the
Athenian fear that the Spartans

26:29.777 --> 26:33.387
will be coming.
So it's in that hot

26:33.392 --> 26:38.332
environment, where fear is all
over the place,

26:38.328 --> 26:44.468
that this new democratic
constitution will be shaped.

26:44.470 --> 26:49.200
There's no question that,
I think, the place where it's

26:49.202 --> 26:53.872
happening is in the assembly.
The assembly sits as you,

26:53.873 --> 26:57.473
I hope you know,
on a hillside in the middle of

26:57.468 --> 27:00.298
Athens,
on a hill called the

27:00.301 --> 27:06.461
pynx and there in the
open air all adult male citizens

27:06.457 --> 27:11.687
are eligible to participate in
what takes place.

27:11.690 --> 27:14.800
One little point,
I'd also suggest to you,

27:14.800 --> 27:19.350
is what about the people who
have been thrown off the citizen

27:19.351 --> 27:21.591
lists?
Are they there?

27:21.590 --> 27:25.900
This is just my reasoning;
we don't have any hard evidence.

27:25.900 --> 27:29.160
My answer is absolutely they
are.

27:29.160 --> 27:32.340
Who is going to tell them not
to?

27:32.339 --> 27:35.909
You show up on the hill,
who's going to kick you off?

27:35.910 --> 27:38.090
Does Cleisthenes want you
kicked out?

27:38.089 --> 27:42.669
Hell no, because as we will
see, one of his main planks is

27:42.668 --> 27:45.638
enrolling those people as
citizens.

27:45.640 --> 27:47.910
So, in fact,
I will bet a lot of money that

27:47.909 --> 27:50.519
in all the electioneering that
went on about all these

27:50.523 --> 27:53.293
different things,
they were a group he must have

27:53.290 --> 27:56.400
targeted and said you've been
unfairly treated by these

27:56.404 --> 27:58.424
aristocrats.
If I get in power,

27:58.416 --> 28:02.106
I will see to it that you are
enrolled again as citizens.

28:02.109 --> 28:05.879
So, all of that is happening,
and people are very excited

28:05.884 --> 28:10.264
about what is going on.
That's the background for these

28:10.256 --> 28:15.536
rather dry and puzzling details
I'm about to lay on you to try

28:15.543 --> 28:20.923
to describe what these new laws
were that amounted to some kind

28:20.916 --> 28:24.906
of a democracy.
The center of them,

28:24.907 --> 28:30.597
apparently, was reforms of the
tribes, and they are in some

28:30.601 --> 28:34.371
ways very radical indeed.
As you know,

28:34.373 --> 28:38.643
these tribes go back before the
birth of history.

28:38.640 --> 28:41.790
Think of any primitive society
you want to;

28:41.789 --> 28:43.639
it's likely to be divided up
into tribes.

28:43.640 --> 28:47.900
The tribes typically are
alleged to come from some very

28:47.897 --> 28:51.757
ancient times when gods or
heroes founded them.

28:51.759 --> 28:54.789
That's certainly true of the
Greek tribes,

28:54.792 --> 28:58.492
where each tribe is named after
some heroic figure,

28:58.491 --> 29:01.451
some semi-divine figure in the
past.

29:01.450 --> 29:04.270
So, there are four,
the four traditional Ionian

29:04.265 --> 29:07.995
tribes, and that's why this is
even more radical than anything

29:07.999 --> 29:11.929
else.
Cleisthenes' law changes the

29:11.926 --> 29:18.676
tribal system in Athens from
four tribes to ten tribes,

29:18.680 --> 29:22.140
absolutely brand new things
that have no tradition behind

29:22.139 --> 29:24.609
them, nothing,
no history or anything.

29:24.609 --> 29:27.709
Then he has to give names to
these tribes,

29:27.712 --> 29:31.952
and according to the Greek
practice, these tribes have to

29:31.949 --> 29:35.429
have some founding hero to be
named after.

29:35.430 --> 29:40.040
So, he picks out,
I think I'm right in thinking,

29:40.040 --> 29:45.470
hundred names of heroes and he
assigns them to the ten tribes

29:45.465 --> 29:48.715
by lot,
and now you suddenly have ten

29:48.723 --> 29:50.403
new tribes.
Now, I mean,

29:50.402 --> 29:53.372
if you can try to think
yourself back to a tribal

29:53.370 --> 29:57.020
society and think about what a
disruptive thing this is.

29:57.019 --> 30:00.919
All my life I've been a member
of the tribe named after,

30:00.923 --> 30:05.113
Ion, and so have my ancestors,
and so my other ancestors.

30:05.110 --> 30:07.270
No more.
He's not around anymore;

30:07.269 --> 30:11.129
there's a new tribe that was
invented that I'm a member of.

30:11.130 --> 30:15.440
So, that's a very surprising
thing.

30:15.440 --> 30:17.300
But that's not the end of the
story;

30:17.299 --> 30:23.999
each tribe now is divided up
into three parts.

30:24.000 --> 30:28.900
The word for a third is
trittys and the plural is

30:28.903 --> 30:32.473
trittyes,
and here's the point.

30:32.470 --> 30:41.170
Each of the tribes has one of
its trittys in and around

30:41.173 --> 30:48.143
the city of Athens.
It has another one in the

30:48.141 --> 30:57.351
middle of Athens and it--I'm
sorry, in the middle of Attica

30:57.354 --> 31:06.254
and the third will be in the
region called the coast,

31:06.250 --> 31:10.780
the Peralia.
So every tribe is

31:10.777 --> 31:15.047
geographically distributed
across all of Attica,

31:15.045 --> 31:18.945
in this way that is something
quite new.

31:18.950 --> 31:23.290
In the old days we have to
believe that the tribes were

31:23.285 --> 31:27.295
geographically separated for
regions for tribes.

31:33.299 --> 31:35.869
The city region,
the coast region,

31:35.865 --> 31:39.905
and the midland region,
each one of these regions has

31:39.907 --> 31:44.257
ten trittyes,
one for each of the ten tribes.

31:44.259 --> 31:50.179
Now, let's take it a step
further, the trittyes

31:50.177 --> 31:57.097
themselves are formed of units
that are called demes.

31:57.099 --> 31:59.969
The Greek word for it,
and it's very confusing,

31:59.974 --> 32:03.344
is demos.
Now, the demos is this

32:03.337 --> 32:05.957
deme, this political
unit.

32:05.960 --> 32:10.610
It also means a village,
it also means the whole

32:10.614 --> 32:15.274
Athenian people,
and it also means only the poor

32:15.269 --> 32:19.079
Athenian people.
So, there you are.

32:19.079 --> 32:23.159
But in the context that we're
dealing with it here,

32:23.157 --> 32:27.317
we mean these units that are
geographical and have a

32:27.316 --> 32:30.816
constitutional function.
There is,

32:30.824 --> 32:35.354
however, even here a certain
amount of confusion,

32:35.345 --> 32:39.955
because some of the
demes are actually made

32:39.960 --> 32:44.160
up of an original village.
They don't mess with that.

32:44.160 --> 32:46.690
A deme is the equivalent
of a--in other words,

32:46.686 --> 32:49.626
a deme is a deme.
The two different meanings of

32:49.631 --> 32:52.711
the word deme;
other demes for the

32:52.711 --> 32:57.471
constitutional purpose are made
up of a number of villages.

32:57.470 --> 33:00.890
So, there would be a lot of
these old demes placed

33:00.887 --> 33:03.447
into the new constitutional
deme.

33:03.450 --> 33:07.650
The idea, however,
is that every trittys

33:07.647 --> 33:12.207
must be of the same size in
terms of population,

33:12.210 --> 33:17.210
because the whole idea is to
get each tribe to be numerically

33:17.205 --> 33:20.115
equal and one reason for that
is,

33:20.119 --> 33:24.969
because the tribes will be the
regiments of the Athenian army.

33:24.970 --> 33:28.170
You line up and fight in
your--when you're called to

33:28.168 --> 33:31.678
fight in the army in accordance
with your deme,

33:31.680 --> 33:33.950
which is located in the certain
trittys,

33:33.948 --> 33:38.338
which becomes a regiment.
Your tribe is a regiment of the

33:38.338 --> 33:41.328
army.
Now, get this straight,

33:41.332 --> 33:46.052
now the demes are
unequal in population but the

33:46.047 --> 33:49.247
trittyes have to be
equal,

33:49.250 --> 33:52.530
so that tells you you have to
have multiple demes in

33:52.531 --> 33:55.191
some and just one or two or a
few in another.

34:07.190 --> 34:11.830
It is also true that the
trittyes are assigned to

34:11.828 --> 34:15.618
the tribes by lot,
and the thing I want you to

34:15.623 --> 34:18.623
remember,
and I want to avoid as much

34:18.622 --> 34:21.932
complication as I can,
is that it doesn't really

34:21.934 --> 34:25.744
matter to the people who
invented the constitution,

34:25.739 --> 34:30.119
how the demes are assigned to
the trittyes,

34:30.121 --> 34:34.321
except one scholar has
suggested one motive that

34:34.323 --> 34:37.993
strikes most of us as very
plausible.

34:37.989 --> 34:42.589
He made a careful study of how
the demes had been

34:42.585 --> 34:46.425
distributed to the
trittyes and compared

34:46.428 --> 34:51.858
them with where we know there
were important religious sites.

34:51.860 --> 34:56.340
Greek religion has many
gods and deities and they have

34:56.342 --> 35:00.632
local characteristics,
because there are legends about

35:00.626 --> 35:04.796
their having lived on this
earth, at a certain place,

35:04.800 --> 35:10.040
or done a deed at another place.
So, you have a cave of Pan in

35:10.035 --> 35:13.615
eastern Attica,
and you have a place where

35:13.619 --> 35:17.189
Athena did this,
that, and the other thing,

35:17.190 --> 35:21.160
and the point I'm getting at is
these became shrines,

35:21.159 --> 35:26.129
places where the religion was
exercised in ancient Attica,

35:26.131 --> 35:29.681
aristocratic Attica.
The aristocrats owned a piece

35:29.680 --> 35:33.000
of land on which the shrine was,
which meant you had to have

35:32.997 --> 35:35.637
their permission to come onto it
to worship,

35:35.639 --> 35:38.189
which meant that they would
have predominance,

35:38.188 --> 35:40.338
power, and influence in these
areas.

35:40.340 --> 35:45.940
Well, what this scholar,
David Lewis was his name,

35:45.944 --> 35:52.814
concluded was that there are
quite a few times when the thing

35:52.806 --> 36:00.006
is laid out in such a way as to
divide the religious site on the

36:00.012 --> 36:06.762
aristocrats land from his main
dwelling on that land,

36:06.760 --> 36:11.320
so the aristocrat is separated
from the place where he has

36:11.315 --> 36:15.465
religious clout as a way of
dividing up his political

36:15.471 --> 36:19.501
influence and power.
He reads this as one of the

36:19.503 --> 36:23.893
ways in which Cleisthenes
attempted to diminish the power

36:23.886 --> 36:27.796
of the aristocracy through its
local influence.

36:31.099 --> 36:34.079
Now, this new deme
is very, very important.

36:34.079 --> 36:39.829
It is the basic unit in the
whole system.

36:39.829 --> 36:41.739
It was meant,
I should say,

36:41.737 --> 36:44.817
to take the place of the
phratry;

36:44.820 --> 36:48.300
you remember the brotherhood
that was kernel of the old

36:48.299 --> 36:50.759
tribal system.
It was meant that the

36:50.757 --> 36:53.407
deme should be the basic
thing.

36:53.409 --> 36:56.509
For instance,
one of the most important

36:56.511 --> 37:00.511
things was that your
citizenship, according to the

37:00.511 --> 37:04.991
laws of Cleisthenes,
was no longer to be ascertained

37:04.989 --> 37:10.109
by going to your phratry,
but each deme would keep

37:10.109 --> 37:14.659
an official roll of the citizens
in that deme.

37:14.659 --> 37:19.089
So, when an Athenian boy is
born, when he reaches a certain

37:19.086 --> 37:23.966
age, you have to take him to the
deme and register him,

37:23.969 --> 37:26.929
and now he can be an Athenian
citizen.

37:26.929 --> 37:31.929
Well, this was one of several
things that we see in

37:31.929 --> 37:37.929
Cleisthenes' constitution in
which the intention could not be

37:37.929 --> 37:41.409
carried out.
That is, the phratry,

37:41.408 --> 37:44.758
and the notion of the
phratry as the core of

37:44.764 --> 37:47.184
such things, was never
abolished;

37:47.179 --> 37:50.909
it would have been out of the
question to abolish it.

37:50.909 --> 37:53.309
It had too many religious
associations,

37:53.312 --> 37:56.982
and it never really lost its
place in the Athenian mind.

37:56.980 --> 38:01.080
Yes, your official enrollment
as a citizen was in the

38:01.077 --> 38:05.957
deme, but there was still
a tremendous allegiance to the

38:05.962 --> 38:08.822
phratry,
and the phratry was

38:08.815 --> 38:13.655
still run by aristocrats.
So, it didn't have its full

38:13.656 --> 38:17.346
effect.
The deme elected an

38:17.353 --> 38:20.463
official called a
demarche.

38:20.460 --> 38:24.230
We might call them mayor or
whatever the local official is

38:24.233 --> 38:28.143
called, select men we say
sometimes still in Connecticut,

38:28.139 --> 38:29.819
holding to our colonial
traditions.

38:33.800 --> 38:37.100
The deme is also given
religious functions and

38:37.097 --> 38:39.947
religious rights,
because everybody knows that

38:39.951 --> 38:43.471
religion still is potent,
even if you're engaged in a

38:43.465 --> 38:47.185
revolution in Athens at the
beginning of the fifth century.

38:52.960 --> 38:55.240
Here's another thing that they
tried to do.

38:55.239 --> 38:59.879
Cleisthenes tried with the law,
to change the way in which an

38:59.879 --> 39:02.739
Athenian was officially
designated.

39:02.739 --> 39:05.799
It used to be,
before Cleisthenes came along,

39:05.795 --> 39:11.955
you ask a man who are you.
He would say I am Cleisthenes,

39:11.957 --> 39:16.667
the son of Megacles.
Just the patronymic,

39:16.667 --> 39:22.117
just like you bear the name of
your father, unless you chose to

39:22.117 --> 39:26.207
bear the name of your mother,
which is evidence of how

39:26.208 --> 39:27.698
un-Athenian you really are.

39:31.449 --> 39:35.289
So, that's the way it was,
but under the laws of

39:35.293 --> 39:39.713
Cleisthenes, henceforth,
citizens were to be designated

39:39.709 --> 39:43.339
not as Cleisthenes,
son of Megacles,

39:43.344 --> 39:48.944
but as Cleisthenes from
Alopeke, which is to say his

39:48.935 --> 39:51.945
deme.
He was to be the citizen's

39:51.952 --> 39:53.372
name and his deme name.

39:56.590 --> 40:00.500
People have argued about what
the point of all this was,

40:00.496 --> 40:04.706
but I think one limited point,
before we get to the full

40:04.708 --> 40:09.358
story, is simply another way of
cutting down the influence of

40:09.359 --> 40:12.869
birth in the society.
It's a way of damaging the

40:12.872 --> 40:16.312
aristocratic principle and
asserting in its place--look

40:16.305 --> 40:20.335
what's really happening here,
that there is something which

40:20.344 --> 40:24.494
is the polis that has
nothing to do with birth that is

40:24.491 --> 40:28.571
the part of the legal structure
which is a polis.

40:28.570 --> 40:32.490
It's a whole new concept that's
really creeping in here,

40:32.492 --> 40:36.702
replacing the old traditional
way of organizing society with

40:36.700 --> 40:41.190
one that is the work of citizens
coming together and determining

40:41.193 --> 40:44.263
how they themselves will be
governed.

40:48.809 --> 40:53.349
Let that be the story of the
tribes for a moment.

40:53.349 --> 40:55.669
Now, here we go with
another council,

40:55.674 --> 40:58.354
you've heard about the council
of four hundred,

40:58.347 --> 41:01.367
you've heard about the council
of three hundred.

41:01.370 --> 41:05.070
We can do better than that;
we're going to have the council

41:05.071 --> 41:08.281
of five hundred.
It will be the council that is

41:08.284 --> 41:12.464
the democratic council for the
remainder of the history of the

41:12.463 --> 41:16.303
Athenian democracy,
with the exception of short

41:16.302 --> 41:20.452
periods of oligarchic rebellion
that remove it,

41:20.449 --> 41:24.909
but it comes back when the
democracy does.

41:24.909 --> 41:28.889
That council--let me simply
describe it very briefly.

41:28.889 --> 41:33.919
It is open to all Athenian
adult male citizens.

41:33.920 --> 41:41.020
Membership on the council comes
through some combination of

41:41.018 --> 41:48.118
allotment and election--the
point of it is that an assembly

41:48.117 --> 41:54.967
of thousands is not well
equipped to conduct all kinds of

41:54.970 --> 42:01.580
business that has to be
conducted for the state,

42:01.580 --> 42:05.700
and even its own business.
You need a smaller group to

42:05.697 --> 42:09.867
prepare the agenda for a full
assembly meeting,

42:09.866 --> 42:14.576
and so that was the function of
the five hundred.

42:14.579 --> 42:18.199
It is, and this is very
important, one of those very

42:18.199 --> 42:21.229
democratic elements,
the assembly of course was

42:21.226 --> 42:24.636
totally democratic,
because adult male citizens

42:24.640 --> 42:28.450
participate if they wish.
But you can easily get around

42:28.446 --> 42:32.596
that in some degree if you have
a council or little group that

42:32.604 --> 42:35.744
actually determines what's going
to happen.

42:35.740 --> 42:42.440
From the first it wasn't so.
The members of the council had

42:42.436 --> 42:47.576
to be--I'm sorry,
the council itself was as

42:47.583 --> 42:53.213
democratic as the assembly.
So, we'll come back to that

42:53.214 --> 42:56.404
council later on,
but there it is in place.

42:56.400 --> 42:58.700
Another thing that happened,
not in 508-7,

42:58.696 --> 43:02.166
but a few years down the road,
but still in the same period,

43:02.170 --> 43:07.930
was that by now the army of
Athens, which originally had

43:07.930 --> 43:12.330
been led simply by the
polemarch,

43:12.329 --> 43:15.759
the archon who was
chosen for the military

43:15.756 --> 43:19.536
leadership had given way to
generals who commanded the

43:19.540 --> 43:24.100
different tribes.
It used to be that each tribe

43:24.095 --> 43:29.355
elected its own general,
but in the new system now,

43:29.362 --> 43:36.212
the entire people elected the
generals for each of the tribes.

43:36.210 --> 43:39.250
In other words,
the ten tribes still had a

43:39.251 --> 43:42.291
general a piece,
but the entire population

43:42.293 --> 43:44.473
elected him.
Usually,

43:44.469 --> 43:48.679
he came from the tribe that he
was asked to command,

43:48.675 --> 43:51.885
but not always.
Again, you can see what the

43:51.887 --> 43:55.067
point of this is;
it has the same characteristic

43:55.069 --> 43:57.639
as so much of what we are
describing.

43:57.639 --> 44:00.819
It is going to reduce
particularism,

44:00.821 --> 44:06.091
localism, and make the whole
people, the whole demos

44:06.092 --> 44:10.552
and their represented
institutions be the decisive

44:10.546 --> 44:15.236
element in the state.
And that is one of the things

44:15.244 --> 44:20.044
we'll be getting to right next
to ask ourselves what's going on

44:20.043 --> 44:24.533
here and why is it happening.
Here, l will tell you what our

44:24.527 --> 44:28.337
sources say and at the end of
the day we have to make some

44:28.340 --> 44:30.340
judgments.
Of course,

44:30.338 --> 44:35.088
generally and I think properly,
the source who gets the most

44:35.093 --> 44:38.723
credence from scholars today is
Herodotus,

44:38.719 --> 44:43.109
who is closer to it in time
than, although he's--I should

44:43.113 --> 44:47.353
point out Herodotus is writing
his history sometime,

44:47.349 --> 44:51.259
and at least he's writing it as
late as the 420s,

44:51.260 --> 44:55.010
but he himself,
goes back to an earlier part of

44:55.007 --> 44:59.427
the fifth century.
Therefore, he is in a position

44:59.430 --> 45:04.520
to hear stories from people who
go back even into the sixth

45:04.515 --> 45:07.085
century,
which makes him theoretically a

45:07.092 --> 45:09.642
more credible source than people
like Aristotle,

45:09.639 --> 45:13.739
who I'll be quoting at you,
who lives in the fourth century

45:13.736 --> 45:17.476
and he's a good whole century
later than Herodotus.

45:17.480 --> 45:21.790
But Herodotus is not,
of course, himself a witness to

45:21.790 --> 45:25.360
any of the facts that he
adduces.Anyway,

45:25.355 --> 45:30.075
he asks why did Cleisthenes of
Athens do what he did.

45:30.079 --> 45:32.879
And his answer is a pretty
stale one.

45:32.880 --> 45:37.920
He was trying to copy his
ancestor Cleisthenes of Sicyon,

45:37.920 --> 45:42.870
who also changed the tribes,
you may remember in Sicyon,

45:42.871 --> 45:47.791
from the old Dorian tribes to
new tribes that designated the

45:47.792 --> 45:53.132
wrong people like--I mean to say
the Dorians as swine men and ass

45:53.129 --> 45:56.699
men,
and so on.

45:56.699 --> 45:59.589
That's why Cleisthenes did it,
and he thought it would be a

45:59.591 --> 46:02.131
nice thing to do because his
ancestor, his namesake,

46:02.133 --> 46:05.783
did the same thing.
Well, I don't think we can buy

46:05.780 --> 46:08.500
that.
We move into a more persuasive

46:08.499 --> 46:12.939
territory I think when we get to
Aristotle, who writes in his

46:12.937 --> 46:16.857
Politics as follows:
"perhaps a question rather

46:16.858 --> 46:19.588
arises,"
he's dealing with the whole

46:19.590 --> 46:22.800
question of citizenship,
"about those who had been

46:22.804 --> 46:26.874
admitted to citizenship after a
revolution had taken place.

46:26.869 --> 46:32.069
For instance such a creation of
citizens as that carried out at

46:32.067 --> 46:36.737
Athens by Cleisthenes,
after the expulsion of the

46:36.744 --> 46:43.104
tyrants, when he enrolled in his
tribes many resident aliens,

46:43.099 --> 46:47.519
metics,
who had been foreigners and

46:47.521 --> 46:50.121
slaves."
So, here's a new story that we

46:50.119 --> 46:52.799
have to add to the picture,
I mentioned it in passing,

46:52.802 --> 46:55.282
but it's very important.
One of the things

46:55.284 --> 46:57.624
Cleisthenes does,
and he has to do it through

46:57.618 --> 46:59.738
measures passed through the
assembly,

46:59.739 --> 47:04.049
is to enfranchise the people
who had been thrown off the

47:04.047 --> 47:05.297
citizen lists.

47:10.050 --> 47:13.990
One thing that you want to do,
and you couldn't have done

47:13.985 --> 47:17.425
that, given the nature of the
old constitution.

47:17.429 --> 47:20.749
If you hadn't broken up the old
system of tribes,

47:20.746 --> 47:22.746
phratres,
and so on,

47:22.750 --> 47:26.040
and come up with a new one
which would not have the old

47:26.038 --> 47:29.068
prejudices against it.
So, that's part of the story.

47:29.070 --> 47:33.220
Again, Aristotle or one of his
pupils--there's some dispute

47:33.216 --> 47:37.146
about the document that is
called the Constitution of

47:37.147 --> 47:41.127
Athens,
as to whether Aristotle was the

47:41.129 --> 47:45.539
composer of that piece or one of
his students.

47:45.539 --> 47:49.539
Anyway, here's what it says,
"with the aim of mixing up the

47:49.544 --> 47:53.144
population, so that a great
number would share ii the

47:53.135 --> 47:58.695
citizenship,
they came up with this phrase,

47:58.695 --> 48:07.305
me phylokrinein, do not
judge according to tribe."

48:07.309 --> 48:10.699
But it goes beyond tribe,
it really means,

48:10.695 --> 48:13.745
do not judge on the basis of
birth.

48:13.750 --> 48:19.320
Aristotle says it was
directed against those who

48:19.320 --> 48:23.580
wanted to check on family
background.

48:23.579 --> 48:25.919
He goes on to say this new
nomenclature,

48:25.916 --> 48:29.566
that's what I just mentioned to
you before about your name,

48:29.570 --> 48:34.640
that is, you are not the son of
so and so, but rather you are of

48:34.637 --> 48:38.617
the deme so and so.
He says, "so that they would

48:38.622 --> 48:42.522
not by addressing one another by
their father's names and expose

48:42.521 --> 48:46.281
the newly enrolled citizens,
but would call them by the

48:46.278 --> 48:50.168
families of the demes."
This passage caused a great

48:50.173 --> 48:53.643
deal of puzzle and confusion
among scholars who couldn't

48:53.642 --> 48:56.042
understand what this was all
about,

48:56.039 --> 48:59.749
and that's I think,
because the topic was mostly

48:59.747 --> 49:04.707
treated by the British.
But Americans can see this

49:04.710 --> 49:07.100
right away.
The best way to put it is this

49:07.101 --> 49:08.621
way--of course you wouldn't know
about this.

49:08.619 --> 49:12.429
You live in a country that is
absolutely pure and without

49:12.425 --> 49:16.365
prejudice, according to race or
color, or ethnic origins or

49:16.366 --> 49:18.556
religion;
so you won't know what I'm

49:18.562 --> 49:22.232
talking about.
But let me pass on from an

49:22.231 --> 49:27.051
earlier generation,
a darker time in which I

49:27.045 --> 49:33.425
grew.Suppose you're a man
who came from the Abruzzi in

49:33.428 --> 49:37.698
Italy,
and your name was Giovanni

49:37.695 --> 49:41.185
DeStefano.
That was fine in the Abruzzi,

49:41.188 --> 49:45.378
but in America there were
people that didn't have a high

49:45.375 --> 49:49.865
opinion of people with such a
name and were likely not to be

49:49.868 --> 49:53.978
opening their doors or homes to
people like that.

49:53.980 --> 50:01.100
So, your son instead of calling
himself Giovanni DeStefano

50:01.100 --> 50:06.970
changed his name to John
Stevens, and thereupon,

50:06.971 --> 50:12.621
everything was okay.
That' the way things were meant

50:12.624 --> 50:14.904
to be in Athens.
That is to say,

50:14.901 --> 50:17.471
the idea was if you had a
foreign sounding name,

50:17.473 --> 50:20.433
and your father would have a
foreign sounding name,

50:20.429 --> 50:23.439
if he came from a foreign place
when he settled in Attica.

50:23.440 --> 50:26.450
You would be branded in that
way and people who wanted,

50:26.453 --> 50:30.633
and here it was more specific,
to throw you off the citizen

50:30.634 --> 50:35.594
lists would know who you were,
but if you took a good solid

50:35.593 --> 50:39.783
Anglo Athenian name,
why, you'd be all right.

50:39.780 --> 50:43.960
So, I think that is the
explanation and it's all part of

50:43.955 --> 50:47.425
the same picture.
Taking away the traditional

50:47.426 --> 50:51.596
influences that would be
anti-democratic and replacing

50:51.599 --> 50:54.749
them with things that shattered
that,

50:54.750 --> 50:59.760
and taking away the local
powers, anything that smacked of

50:59.757 --> 51:03.707
the past, you try to erase as
best you can.

51:07.489 --> 51:10.369
The procedure,
we all agree,

51:10.365 --> 51:16.645
is by the device that the
Greeks called psephisma.

51:16.650 --> 51:22.240
It was a motion passed by the
assembly, and it comes to be the

51:22.238 --> 51:27.458
standard form of legislation in
the Athenian democracy,

51:27.460 --> 51:31.390
the plural of psephisma
is psephismata.

51:31.389 --> 51:36.479
Now, the scholar who I was
eluding to a few moments ago

51:36.484 --> 51:40.354
Lewis, he's got the general
picture right.

51:40.349 --> 51:43.209
He says we have to understand
all of this was passed on the

51:43.207 --> 51:45.667
assembly in a mood of great
excitement and fear,

51:45.670 --> 51:51.460
and anger, a revolutionary
situation in which he imagined

51:51.464 --> 51:54.784
alluding to the revolution in
St.

51:54.776 --> 51:59.636
Petersburg in 1917,
that they are getting up and

51:59.639 --> 52:04.399
shouting, "all power to the ten
tribes."

52:04.400 --> 52:06.800
To those of you who are not in
St.

52:06.802 --> 52:11.322
Petersburg, they were shouting,
"all power to the Soviets," but

52:11.315 --> 52:15.255
I think he's wrong.
It wasn't about the ten tribes.

52:15.260 --> 52:17.150
The ten tribes weren't the
issue.

52:17.150 --> 52:20.700
I think if they were shouting
and I guess they were,

52:20.699 --> 52:24.249
they were shouting all power to
the ecclesia,

52:24.248 --> 52:27.888
to the assembly.
That's where decisions were

52:27.891 --> 52:32.321
going to be made in the future.
But I do want you to take

52:32.323 --> 52:36.623
seriously the notion that the
making of such a claim and doing

52:36.624 --> 52:40.014
so in heated circumstances was
revolutionary,

52:40.010 --> 52:43.860
because without that,
it's inconceivable that what

52:43.856 --> 52:49.126
happened would have happened.
Now, let me go back to the

52:49.126 --> 52:52.526
boule;
it was elected by a lot from

52:52.534 --> 52:56.034
proportional representation in
the demes,

52:56.034 --> 52:59.474
all Athenians.
The Greek word for preparing

52:59.474 --> 53:04.134
legislation for an assembly is
probouleusis and such a

53:04.134 --> 53:09.104
group is probouleutic,
that is, it prepares

53:09.098 --> 53:13.148
legislation.
The chances are that this

53:13.151 --> 53:18.811
council was more powerful and
had more independence when it

53:18.814 --> 53:22.724
was invented,
than it would later on.

53:22.719 --> 53:25.909
That's just a guess,
but you know you're at the

53:25.907 --> 53:29.527
beginning of something.
You're still living in a

53:29.528 --> 53:33.698
society in which class
distinctions are very clear and

53:33.698 --> 53:36.608
very sharp,
in which the idea of the

53:36.605 --> 53:41.035
ordinary citizen taking things
into his own hands is new and

53:41.043 --> 53:43.843
scary.
I think there would have been a

53:43.840 --> 53:47.740
lot of deference paid to the
individuals who came from the

53:47.738 --> 53:50.888
higher classes,
and I would guess that they

53:50.890 --> 53:54.230
would have been on the
preliminary list that was

53:54.234 --> 53:57.654
elected before allotment
selected among them,

53:57.650 --> 54:02.810
and that when they proposed
something to the assembly,

54:02.809 --> 54:07.779
it would be given greater
influence on what happened

54:07.775 --> 54:12.685
subsequently than would be true.
When we get down to the

54:12.691 --> 54:15.931
full scale of Athenian democracy
in the time of Pericles forget

54:15.932 --> 54:19.352
about it.
The boule is the servant

54:19.354 --> 54:22.514
of the assembly,
without question.

54:22.510 --> 54:25.940
If the council sends in a
proposed law in certain

54:25.937 --> 54:30.437
language, the assembly can vote
it down or they can send it back

54:30.435 --> 54:34.135
to the boule and say,
no we don't like those words;

54:34.139 --> 54:36.789
change the words into this
direction, and then send it back

54:36.785 --> 54:38.655
to us.
That's the way it was in the

54:38.658 --> 54:42.108
full democracy.
My guess is it wasn't that way

54:42.105 --> 54:46.005
in the year 505.
I think it probably was meant

54:46.013 --> 54:50.903
by Cleisthenes to be a bit more
conservative without being,

54:50.901 --> 54:54.021
of course in any way,
reactionary.

54:58.420 --> 55:05.450
Now, what is this all about
in the larger sense?

55:05.449 --> 55:09.529
Lewis suggests that there's
something here that is personal

55:09.527 --> 55:12.267
and political and I think he's
right.

55:12.269 --> 55:17.089
One of the elements that he
suggests is these demes

55:17.091 --> 55:21.491
were not assigned to
trittyes accidentally,

55:21.489 --> 55:26.319
as I've suggested already,
but were carefully laid out not

55:26.318 --> 55:30.978
only to deprive noblemen of
their undue influence but he

55:30.977 --> 55:35.637
thinks probably to help
Cleisthenes and his Alcmaeonidae

55:35.636 --> 55:40.626
to have a powerful voice in as
much of Attica as he possibly

55:40.634 --> 55:43.994
could.
Why in the world would anybody

55:43.991 --> 55:46.091
doubt that?
That strikes me as

55:46.089 --> 55:50.189
being--that's what people do
when they have the power to help

55:50.187 --> 55:53.417
themselves politically they do.
I would guess,

55:53.415 --> 55:56.385
in other words,
Cleisthenes was thinking of his

55:56.390 --> 56:00.140
own political position in part.
Again, we don't have hard

56:00.144 --> 56:02.574
evidence for this,
but just a reasonable

56:02.569 --> 56:06.009
suggestion.
Now, the other thing is,

56:06.010 --> 56:10.050
we have to, I think,
believe, that this whole

56:10.048 --> 56:15.648
program of reform was supported
by what we have been referring

56:15.647 --> 56:18.647
to all along,
the hoplite class,

56:18.648 --> 56:23.798
these independent farmers.
They are the ones who are most

56:23.797 --> 56:27.157
numerous.
They are among those who will

56:27.159 --> 56:31.539
be politically active.
Also, they are of course the

56:31.537 --> 56:35.887
defense of Athens now,
they have to be taken very

56:35.888 --> 56:41.418
seriously and they are not about
to allow themselves to be cut

56:41.418 --> 56:46.308
out or to have their own
influence diminished by things

56:46.312 --> 56:51.572
that are hanging over from the
days of aristocracy.

56:51.570 --> 56:54.920
So, I think we should think of
this and I think just about

56:54.920 --> 56:58.230
everybody does.
They like to designate this

56:58.231 --> 57:01.911
Cleisthenic democracy,
this first democracy,

57:01.913 --> 57:06.373
as a hoplite democracy,
and saying that the hoplites

57:06.365 --> 57:10.175
were in means that to some
considerable degree,

57:10.180 --> 57:15.090
the poor are out.
The chances are very great;

57:15.090 --> 57:21.430
I would say pretty certain,
that the majority of citizens,

57:21.426 --> 57:27.536
the majority of Athenian
citizens, were not hoplites.

57:27.540 --> 57:32.770
They were thetes.
There probably never was a

57:32.773 --> 57:38.393
time when the hoplites were a
majority even in Athens.

57:38.389 --> 57:43.049
So, excluding them certainly is
a limit on what you want to call

57:43.054 --> 57:47.354
democracy, and here's where we
get into sort of the debates

57:47.349 --> 57:51.509
these days.
Many, many a scholar--now that

57:51.512 --> 57:57.212
the academy is essentially a
branch of the Politburo will

57:57.210 --> 58:02.300
want to denigrate ancient
Athenian democracy and to

58:02.298 --> 58:06.468
suggest it really wasn't
democratic.

58:06.469 --> 58:08.349
Well, there are twenty million
ways you can do that.

58:08.349 --> 58:12.389
You can talk about the fact
that it excluded women,

58:12.389 --> 58:16.589
you can talk about the fact
that it--who else does it

58:16.590 --> 58:18.900
exclude?
That it had slaves,

58:18.902 --> 58:22.012
excluded slaves,
it excluded resident aliens,

58:22.011 --> 58:26.041
and all those things and then
you can finally point to the

58:26.038 --> 58:30.418
fact that probably the majority
of the adult male citizens were

58:30.419 --> 58:34.799
excluded from some important
elements in the democracy,

58:34.800 --> 58:37.620
although as time passes that
last disappears,

58:37.618 --> 58:41.008
and you have pretty much
complete participation by the

58:41.013 --> 58:43.253
poor,
but in Cleisthenes case that's

58:43.247 --> 58:45.627
not so.
But I think that's to be

58:45.631 --> 58:48.891
deliberately blind to what's
really happening.

58:48.890 --> 58:54.030
What you have is a miracle.
Nothing in the world that we

58:54.025 --> 58:57.995
know of anywhere,
ever like this has ever been

58:58.003 --> 59:01.123
seen before.
The reaction of the other

59:01.115 --> 59:04.325
Greeks as best we can figure out
was horror.

59:04.329 --> 59:08.299
This is wild and crazy,
the stuff that the Athenians

59:08.302 --> 59:11.732
are doing, it is radical,
it is dangerous.

59:11.730 --> 59:15.430
We must contain ourselves and
avoid being in touch with them,

59:15.433 --> 59:18.153
or we should try to finish
those guys off.

59:18.150 --> 59:21.310
Certainly that was the attitude
the Spartans typically had

59:21.312 --> 59:24.532
towards it, and undoubtedly the
normal Greek government,

59:24.530 --> 59:28.140
which was an oligarchy,
certainly took the same point

59:28.144 --> 59:30.244
of view.
So, I think you can look at it

59:30.244 --> 59:32.734
from either direction,
probably should look at it from

59:32.725 --> 59:35.885
both,
but don't miss the point that

59:35.885 --> 59:41.355
what's happening here is of this
very special character.

59:41.360 --> 59:43.380
What did they call this
constitution?

59:43.380 --> 59:46.690
Well, we don't know.
But the chances are great that

59:46.689 --> 59:49.789
they did not call it democracy.
The word democracy,

59:49.791 --> 59:53.431
our word democracy comes from
the Greek demokratia,

59:53.429 --> 59:57.629
which I guess you would want to
translate as something like

59:57.626 --> 1:00:00.956
power for the masses,
for the people at large,

1:00:00.960 --> 1:00:04.250
or the people as a whole.
But it was a name that was

1:00:04.251 --> 1:00:07.041
given to the Athenian
constitution by a people who

1:00:07.044 --> 1:00:10.184
didn't like it.
What did they think of

1:00:10.179 --> 1:00:15.139
themselves?
Well, Herodotus refers to this

1:00:15.142 --> 1:00:19.342
regime as one of
eisonomia,

1:00:19.335 --> 1:00:24.655
equality of law,
and I think the thing that's

1:00:24.660 --> 1:00:30.170
most important about it is,
equality before the law.

1:00:30.170 --> 1:00:35.230
That is, something that wipes
out distinctions among classes

1:00:35.231 --> 1:00:39.521
of people on the basis when it
comes to the law.

1:00:39.519 --> 1:00:44.259
Every man who comes before the
law is equal to every other man.

1:00:44.260 --> 1:00:48.420
Well, that's a very big change
that no place else in the world

1:00:48.424 --> 1:00:52.184
had, and I think that's not a
bad way to think of it.

1:00:52.179 --> 1:00:57.689
Now, of the principles that
belonged from the first to this

1:00:57.694 --> 1:01:02.054
democracy, and was maybe as
crucial as anything in

1:01:02.052 --> 1:01:07.302
characterizing it was what they
called isegoria,

1:01:07.300 --> 1:01:13.210
equality of speech really.
It meant equality of the

1:01:13.207 --> 1:01:16.887
opportunity to address the
political body,

1:01:16.892 --> 1:01:22.542
meaning the assembly.
Every Athenian male from the

1:01:22.541 --> 1:01:29.151
first adult regardless of what
his money rating was,

1:01:29.150 --> 1:01:32.640
of his class,
whether he was a thete

1:01:32.640 --> 1:01:37.710
or higher, everyone had the
right to speak in the assembly.

1:01:37.710 --> 1:01:41.900
Now, this had been a right that
was limited of course to

1:01:41.902 --> 1:01:45.942
aristocrats in many cities,
or to the wealthy in other

1:01:45.941 --> 1:01:49.691
cities.
But we know from some of the

1:01:49.691 --> 1:01:55.511
poems in the sixth century,
it was prized as the evidence

1:01:55.514 --> 1:02:01.654
that an individual was a free
man as opposed to a slave.

1:02:01.650 --> 1:02:05.450
He could get up in the center,
that was the term they used,

1:02:05.451 --> 1:02:08.071
of the town,
meaning wherever the meeting

1:02:08.072 --> 1:02:10.932
place was,
and then speak his mind and

1:02:10.934 --> 1:02:15.184
also try to persuade his fellow
citizens to do as he thought

1:02:15.183 --> 1:02:17.263
best.
We should not take this

1:02:17.260 --> 1:02:18.740
lightly.
In our world,

1:02:18.736 --> 1:02:22.636
where we never imagine
ourselves in such a situation,

1:02:22.643 --> 1:02:25.953
it's hard to grasp but actually
to think.

1:02:25.949 --> 1:02:28.779
If I want to I can get out
there during the debate that's

1:02:28.775 --> 1:02:32.885
going to decide what happens.
I can say what I have to say.

1:02:32.889 --> 1:02:39.039
So, freedom of speech is very,
very central to the Athenian

1:02:39.035 --> 1:02:41.785
idea of self government.

1:02:44.889 --> 1:02:50.959
The role of the boule in
place of aristocratic councils

1:02:50.961 --> 1:02:54.761
enhances the democracy.
On the other hand,

1:02:54.762 --> 1:02:58.922
things did not happen that you
might think would happen.

1:02:58.920 --> 1:03:05.450
Nothing was done in the sphere
of the economy.

1:03:05.449 --> 1:03:10.179
There was no change in Solonian
classes or privileges.

1:03:10.179 --> 1:03:14.209
You still had to have a certain
amount of money to be elected to

1:03:14.210 --> 1:03:17.830
the top things in the state.
The Areopagus was left

1:03:17.831 --> 1:03:21.081
untouched, remaining a
collection of former

1:03:21.080 --> 1:03:24.870
magistrates, all of whom had
been aristocrats.

1:03:24.869 --> 1:03:28.039
The phratres,
the homes of aristocracy were

1:03:28.043 --> 1:03:31.723
left intact.
You had this hoplite democracy,

1:03:31.716 --> 1:03:36.086
which was indeed democracy,
but we must imagine,

1:03:36.090 --> 1:03:41.110
I think all the evidence would
support this imagination,

1:03:41.108 --> 1:03:45.938
that it was a deferential
democracy in which the lower

1:03:45.944 --> 1:03:51.604
classes still looked up to the
upper classes for leadership and

1:03:51.601 --> 1:03:55.081
guidance,
and they themselves did not

1:03:55.079 --> 1:03:57.969
hold leading positions in the
state.

1:03:57.969 --> 1:04:00.219
I think that's the picture we
have.

1:04:00.219 --> 1:04:05.299
Well, let me turn at last
to one of the most interesting

1:04:05.301 --> 1:04:10.211
features of the constitution
introduced by Cleisthenes;

1:04:10.210 --> 1:04:14.350
gives us a picture of how
things worked that we wouldn't

1:04:14.346 --> 1:04:19.196
get any other way.
I'm talking abut the law that

1:04:19.195 --> 1:04:23.655
was passed on ostracism.
Our word ostracism derives from

1:04:23.656 --> 1:04:25.686
it, but it's something quite
different.

1:04:25.690 --> 1:04:28.820
If somebody says we're going to
ostracize this guy today,

1:04:28.818 --> 1:04:31.778
it means we're not going to
invite him for a drink;

1:04:31.780 --> 1:04:34.210
we're not going to go to his
parties, things like that.

1:04:34.210 --> 1:04:38.120
No this was something far
different and was a central part

1:04:38.117 --> 1:04:41.617
of the political system.
Let me begin by simply

1:04:41.618 --> 1:04:45.518
describing how it worked.
Every year, let us say in the

1:04:45.517 --> 1:04:48.347
month of January,
that's the way the Athenian

1:04:48.352 --> 1:04:52.412
calendar would have made it come
out more or less typically,

1:04:52.409 --> 1:04:58.669
a question came up in the
assembly automatically.

1:04:58.670 --> 1:05:01.010
Nobody had to move it;
it was an automatic thing.

1:05:01.010 --> 1:05:03.920
The question was,
"Shall we have an ostracism

1:05:03.920 --> 1:05:06.480
this year?"
Now, they could debate that

1:05:06.482 --> 1:05:10.142
question, but what they were not
debating was who should we

1:05:10.140 --> 1:05:12.510
ostracize.
That was not at issue.

1:05:12.510 --> 1:05:15.320
The only question was,
should we have one this year?

1:05:15.320 --> 1:05:19.970
If a majority said yes,
then they would go on.

1:05:19.969 --> 1:05:21.709
If they majority said no,
that was it,

1:05:21.712 --> 1:05:25.042
no ostracism that year.
But supposing a majority had

1:05:25.041 --> 1:05:29.111
voted for an ostracism,
now we go to roughly the month

1:05:29.114 --> 1:05:33.114
of March and let's go down to
the center of town,

1:05:33.110 --> 1:05:35.500
the agora,
which is the marketplace,

1:05:35.495 --> 1:05:38.955
which is the political center
which is where people go to talk

1:05:38.960 --> 1:05:42.120
and all those things.
That's where the action is,

1:05:42.115 --> 1:05:45.645
and for that day and that day
alone, the agora is

1:05:45.650 --> 1:05:50.170
fenced off,
and there are ten gates in the

1:05:50.173 --> 1:05:57.183
fences, one for each tribe,
and every citizen who wishes,

1:05:57.179 --> 1:06:03.059
goes with a piece of broken
pottery.

1:06:03.059 --> 1:06:07.809
Someone has described it as the
scrap paper of antiquity,

1:06:07.813 --> 1:06:10.703
and with whatever you could
get,

1:06:10.699 --> 1:06:13.999
piece of glass,
crayon, or whatever,

1:06:14.000 --> 1:06:19.850
you would simply write the name
of a man that you would like to

1:06:19.845 --> 1:06:24.505
see ostracized that year.
You would go to the gate.

1:06:24.510 --> 1:06:27.680
There would be some people at
the gate, who would identify are

1:06:27.678 --> 1:06:30.268
you really a citizen,
where are you coming from and

1:06:30.274 --> 1:06:32.434
all that.
You, then, handed in your

1:06:32.433 --> 1:06:35.583
ostraka and you went
inside the agora,

1:06:35.579 --> 1:06:38.409
where you stayed until the
voting was over so that you

1:06:38.414 --> 1:06:40.344
couldn't come back and vote
again.

1:06:40.340 --> 1:06:46.210
Now, they were cleverer than
the people of Florida are today.

1:06:46.210 --> 1:06:49.530
So, now it's over,
the time has come,

1:06:49.530 --> 1:06:54.590
and what they do is they divide
up all the ostraka that

1:06:54.592 --> 1:06:58.262
have been cast.
They don't divide them up I'm

1:06:58.256 --> 1:07:00.576
sorry.
They put them in a big pile and

1:07:00.576 --> 1:07:04.536
count them.
If there are fewer than 6,000

1:07:04.535 --> 1:07:10.585
ballots, nobody gets ostracized.
If there are 6,000 or more,

1:07:10.586 --> 1:07:15.706
now they divide them up into
piles, and the one who gets the

1:07:15.713 --> 1:07:18.573
most votes,
not majority,

1:07:18.570 --> 1:07:23.870
just the highest number of
votes plurality,

1:07:23.871 --> 1:07:27.391
he wins.
He gets ostracized.What

1:07:27.394 --> 1:07:31.594
does that mean?
It means that he must leave

1:07:31.585 --> 1:07:37.865
Attica, at a certain distance
from Attica, for ten years.

1:07:37.870 --> 1:07:43.640
That's all.
He has been accused of no crime;

1:07:43.639 --> 1:07:47.639
therefore, he has been
convicted of no crime.

1:07:47.640 --> 1:07:51.920
Nothing is done to his property;
nothing is done to his family.

1:07:51.920 --> 1:07:56.880
At the end of ten years,
he may come back and it's as

1:07:56.877 --> 1:07:59.717
though he never left.
The next day,

1:07:59.724 --> 1:08:02.044
if he wants to,
he can run for public office.

1:08:02.040 --> 1:08:07.120
That's all;
that is ostracism.

1:08:07.120 --> 1:08:10.690
What's this all about?
What are the purposes of this

1:08:10.692 --> 1:08:13.852
thing?
Well, I think the best way to

1:08:13.848 --> 1:08:19.118
come at this is to tell you a
couple of stories and some

1:08:19.117 --> 1:08:22.097
facts.
The story I guess comes from

1:08:22.100 --> 1:08:24.750
Plutarch's Life of
Aristides,

1:08:24.751 --> 1:08:28.841
who is one of the leading
Athenian figures at the early

1:08:28.841 --> 1:08:33.451
part of the fifth century,
and who in fact was a man who

1:08:33.447 --> 1:08:37.077
was ultimately ostracized.
The story goes like this.

1:08:37.079 --> 1:08:41.969
It's ostracism day in Athens,
and some country bumpkin,

1:08:41.972 --> 1:08:46.792
some rube comes walking up,
and he spots Aristides chatting

1:08:46.787 --> 1:08:50.807
with some folks and he goes up
to Aristides and he says,

1:08:50.810 --> 1:08:55.070
"excuse me sir I don't know how
to write, would you please write

1:08:55.070 --> 1:08:58.570
a name on this potsherd for me?"
Aristides, of course,

1:08:58.565 --> 1:09:00.555
a gentleman he says,
"certainly sir,

1:09:00.558 --> 1:09:05.368
what name would you like?"
He said, "Aristides please."

1:09:05.369 --> 1:09:08.549
"Oh," he says,
and he writes down Aristides,

1:09:08.545 --> 1:09:12.085
and by the way he said,
"what is it that you have

1:09:12.091 --> 1:09:16.071
against Aristides?"
I should have told you that

1:09:16.074 --> 1:09:19.634
Aristides had earned this
sobriquet,

1:09:19.627 --> 1:09:23.177
the just Aristides,
Aristides the just.

1:09:23.180 --> 1:09:25.510
So, the guy says,
"what have you got against

1:09:25.509 --> 1:09:26.849
Aristides?
I have nothing against

1:09:26.846 --> 1:09:28.466
Aristides, I've never seen the
man, don't know him.

1:09:28.470 --> 1:09:34.320
I'm just so damn tired of
hearing him called the just."

1:09:34.319 --> 1:09:39.789
The point of that story is to
illustrate Plutarch's point is

1:09:39.788 --> 1:09:44.698
that the system of ostracism was
just a piece of silly

1:09:44.699 --> 1:09:49.889
foolishness that you would
associate with democracy,

1:09:49.890 --> 1:09:54.230
which just allowed the jealousy
of the ordinary man for superior

1:09:54.231 --> 1:09:56.851
people to determine what's going
on.

1:09:56.850 --> 1:10:01.170
That's the message that
Plutarch gets from that tale.

1:10:01.170 --> 1:10:02.350
Here's another piece of
information;

1:10:02.350 --> 1:10:05.310
that's not a tale.
I think it was about 1937,1938

1:10:05.308 --> 1:10:09.308
an American archaeologist was
working up on the north slope of

1:10:09.310 --> 1:10:12.000
the Acropolis and he came upon a
well,

1:10:12.000 --> 1:10:17.950
he dug into the well,
and out came 191 inscribed

1:10:17.951 --> 1:10:25.551
potsherds, ostraka with
but one name written on all of

1:10:25.550 --> 1:10:29.930
them,
and that name was Themistocles,

1:10:29.934 --> 1:10:36.214
who we know was a participant
in a batch of ostraka in

1:10:36.214 --> 1:10:39.814
the 480s,
and careful analysis of the

1:10:39.805 --> 1:10:44.555
handwriting indicated that these
191 ostraka were

1:10:44.563 --> 1:10:47.853
inscribed by 14 hands writing
them.

1:10:47.850 --> 1:10:51.620
Is it beginning to sound
familiar to you guys,

1:10:51.615 --> 1:10:54.435
I suppose.
The best guess of everybody who

1:10:54.435 --> 1:10:58.065
studies these things is that we
do not have here the remains of

1:10:58.067 --> 1:11:01.657
a collection of voters,
who voted and had their votes

1:11:01.662 --> 1:11:05.522
counted and then these came,
but rather that these were

1:11:05.522 --> 1:11:08.312
votes that never were cast
actually.

1:11:08.310 --> 1:11:13.880
So what's going on here?
Now, I turn from my attempt at

1:11:13.880 --> 1:11:18.640
a factual account of what
happened in the past to fiction.

1:11:18.640 --> 1:11:21.330
The rest of this is my
imagination.

1:11:21.329 --> 1:11:25.089
We find ourselves down the
middle of Athens,

1:11:25.089 --> 1:11:31.379
the day before the ostracism.
We are in the home of John the

1:11:31.384 --> 1:11:39.034
potter who is a charter member
of the Aristides political club,

1:11:39.029 --> 1:11:45.119
and what they are doing is
sitting about chatting as they

1:11:45.121 --> 1:11:50.561
incise or paint the name onto a
ostrakon,

1:11:50.560 --> 1:11:55.200
the name is Themistocles.
Next day, down there outside

1:11:55.202 --> 1:11:59.372
the Agora, various country
bumpkins and others are

1:11:59.372 --> 1:12:03.822
wandering into town.
You step up to one of them and

1:12:03.824 --> 1:12:05.854
say;
perhaps you would like to vote

1:12:05.853 --> 1:12:08.973
in the ostracism today sir?
I can save you the trouble of

1:12:08.968 --> 1:12:11.518
inscribing your ballot,
here's one right now.

1:12:11.520 --> 1:12:15.630
I think this is pretty good
evidence that they're talking

1:12:15.634 --> 1:12:18.504
about organized political
activities,

1:12:18.500 --> 1:12:26.050
which in fact I think totally
squares with what we know about

1:12:26.051 --> 1:12:30.951
the purpose of ostracism.
I should tell you one other

1:12:30.952 --> 1:12:33.812
thing, that Thucydides himself
says something very important

1:12:33.811 --> 1:12:36.451
about this.
He says, ostracism was brought

1:12:36.450 --> 1:12:39.920
about, because of the fear and
the insecurity that the

1:12:39.915 --> 1:12:42.525
Athenians felt about their
democracy,

1:12:42.529 --> 1:12:46.229
that it was in constant danger,
and that they needed something

1:12:46.230 --> 1:12:48.920
to help them.
That's the context in which he

1:12:48.924 --> 1:12:50.804
used it.
Plutarch, as I say,

1:12:50.800 --> 1:12:54.610
has a more general story,
the envy and jealousy natural

1:12:54.611 --> 1:12:57.321
to democracy.
You must realize that hardly

1:12:57.316 --> 1:13:00.806
anybody who ever wrote anything
in antiquity had a kind word to

1:13:00.807 --> 1:13:04.137
say for democracy;
it's a bad thing from the

1:13:04.137 --> 1:13:08.257
standpoint of most of the
authors of antiquity.

1:13:08.260 --> 1:13:13.460
But Thucydides was there,
while ostracism was a reality,

1:13:13.459 --> 1:13:18.279
as opposed to Plutarch,
and I'm sure he is right.

1:13:18.279 --> 1:13:20.999
Let's look,
first of all,

1:13:20.996 --> 1:13:26.326
at the moment when ostracism
was invented in the time of

1:13:26.331 --> 1:13:30.601
Cleisthenes, before we move
beyond that.

1:13:30.600 --> 1:13:33.800
What's the situation?
Cleisthenes and company have

1:13:33.804 --> 1:13:37.314
just brought about this unique,
amazing, and to the rest of the

1:13:39.859 --> 1:13:43.129
and invented this new wild
crazy kind of government.

1:13:43.130 --> 1:13:48.870
They know that the Spartans are
furious and they expect they're

1:13:48.873 --> 1:13:54.183
going to come down anytime.
They also know that in Athens,

1:13:54.180 --> 1:13:58.810
there are people who don't like
this new government.

1:13:58.810 --> 1:14:03.390
Some of them are the heirs to
the old aristocracy.

1:14:03.390 --> 1:14:07.180
Some of them are aristocrats
themselves.

1:14:07.180 --> 1:14:12.400
Others were very happy in the
days of the tyranny.

1:14:12.399 --> 1:14:16.769
In fact, there are still
relatives of the tyrants,

1:14:16.765 --> 1:14:20.325
eminent ones,
who are still in Athens.

1:14:20.329 --> 1:14:23.159
In other words,
they have to fear betrayal,

1:14:23.158 --> 1:14:27.058
they have to fear internal
hostility, and they have to fear

1:14:27.063 --> 1:14:29.693
people who might start a civil
war.

1:14:29.689 --> 1:14:33.799
At the same time as they have
to be afraid of the Spartans

1:14:33.804 --> 1:14:36.054
coming up the road,
and we know,

1:14:36.054 --> 1:14:38.874
because in a few years this is
going to happen,

1:14:38.870 --> 1:14:41.870
they have enemies of other
neighboring states.

1:14:41.869 --> 1:14:44.119
Corinthians,
the Eretrians,

1:14:44.123 --> 1:14:48.373
Boeotians, Thebes,
and others within the next five

1:14:48.369 --> 1:14:53.569
years--they will have invasions
by those people as well.

1:14:53.569 --> 1:14:56.939
That's their situation,
what are they afraid of?

1:14:56.939 --> 1:15:01.489
They are afraid that there will
be treason inside the city,

1:15:01.494 --> 1:15:05.814
which will help invaders or
simply turn the city over to

1:15:05.813 --> 1:15:07.973
them.
Well then, why don't they just

1:15:07.971 --> 1:15:10.271
lock these guys up?
Well, in the first place,

1:15:10.272 --> 1:15:12.352
they probably haven't done
anything yet,

1:15:12.351 --> 1:15:14.751
and you couldn't make a case
against them.

1:15:14.750 --> 1:15:16.910
On top of which,
you really don't,

1:15:16.907 --> 1:15:20.307
if you're Cleisthenes,
you don't want to treat all of

1:15:20.305 --> 1:15:24.615
these people as though they are
the enemies of the new regime.

1:15:24.619 --> 1:15:27.269
They are, in fact,
natural opponents,

1:15:27.273 --> 1:15:31.183
the friends of the tyrants and
the old aristocrats;

1:15:31.180 --> 1:15:33.430
they're on opposite sides of
the argument.

1:15:33.430 --> 1:15:38.350
Why would you want to put them
together by assaulting their

1:15:38.351 --> 1:15:41.821
leaders?
A smarter thing would be to try

1:15:41.824 --> 1:15:46.744
to win over one faction to
support your side at the expense

1:15:46.735 --> 1:15:49.895
of the other.
That is my guess as to what is

1:15:49.897 --> 1:15:52.667
another explanation of what's
happening here.

1:15:52.670 --> 1:15:55.210
So, here's another piece of
fiction I want to throw at you.

1:15:58.270 --> 1:16:02.360
I imagine that Cleisthenes
stops by at the house of

1:16:02.361 --> 1:16:07.141
Hipparchus, the son of Karmas,
who is a relative of the

1:16:07.135 --> 1:16:12.605
Peisistratids and who would be
looked to as the leading figure

1:16:12.613 --> 1:16:16.213
in that faction,
and he stops by to see

1:16:16.209 --> 1:16:20.759
Hipparchus, and Hipparchus says,
"hello Cleisthenes,

1:16:20.760 --> 1:16:23.550
say what is this routine,
what is this crazy new law that

1:16:23.553 --> 1:16:25.403
you and your boys just put
through,

1:16:25.400 --> 1:16:29.820
this ostracism law?
I hear in the streets that it's

1:16:29.823 --> 1:16:34.863
aimed at me, as the leader of
the old tyranny faction,

1:16:34.855 --> 1:16:38.085
what is that?"
Cleisthenes I imagine would

1:16:38.093 --> 1:16:41.283
say, "Now, where did you get a
crazy idea like that?

1:16:41.279 --> 1:16:44.449
I mean, you're a swell fellow,
I'm only against these terrible

1:16:44.447 --> 1:16:47.067
aristos out there,
and their Spartan lackeys,

1:16:47.069 --> 1:16:49.879
who are going to take away all
the people's rights and I know

1:16:49.882 --> 1:16:51.572
you wouldn't want that to
happen,

1:16:51.570 --> 1:16:55.800
that's not like you.
So, of course I can see your

1:16:55.800 --> 1:17:00.410
point, I can see you are
alarmed, I can see that people

1:17:00.410 --> 1:17:04.150
might say,
gee those old Peisistratids

1:17:04.152 --> 1:17:08.932
might be trying to overthrow
this new democracy,

1:17:08.930 --> 1:17:12.550
and bring themselves back in.
I know Hippeis is over there in

1:17:12.553 --> 1:17:15.893
Persia, supported by the king
and maybe people would think

1:17:15.886 --> 1:17:18.456
you're for bringing him back as
a tyrant.

1:17:18.460 --> 1:17:22.340
I knew that would never be in
your mind, but I tell you what

1:17:22.337 --> 1:17:25.017
you ought to do,
why don't you come over to my

1:17:25.021 --> 1:17:27.611
side and I'll see to it--you
know I have friends,

1:17:27.610 --> 1:17:30.420
I got a lot of friends.
I could do you a favor.

1:17:30.420 --> 1:17:35.310
You do me a favor;
I can do you a favor.

1:17:35.310 --> 1:17:38.080
I can see to it that I would
just kill that rumor,

1:17:38.075 --> 1:17:40.215
and everything would be very
happy."

1:17:40.220 --> 1:17:44.250
The next day all is well.
I think there's considerable

1:17:44.251 --> 1:17:46.631
evidence.
I don't have time for it

1:17:46.630 --> 1:17:50.010
now--not certain,
but evidence suggesting that

1:17:50.005 --> 1:17:54.425
Hipparchus came on board and
became part of a coalition that

1:17:54.430 --> 1:17:57.880
ruled Athens for decades after
that time.

1:17:57.880 --> 1:18:02.710
And so, that year there was no
ostracism, because there didn't

1:18:02.710 --> 1:18:07.410
have to be an ostracism.
I think that is very important.

1:18:07.409 --> 1:18:12.709
Most years there was no
ostracism, only once in a while,

1:18:12.707 --> 1:18:18.487
and every single person that we
hear ostracized was a leading

1:18:18.487 --> 1:18:22.227
political figure.
Ostracism, in short,

1:18:22.229 --> 1:18:26.439
was meant to be a
constitutional device to work in

1:18:26.443 --> 1:18:30.743
the political realm as a way of
deterring a coup

1:18:34.613 --> 1:18:37.213
unrest.
You could only use it as a

1:18:37.208 --> 1:18:40.648
politician if you were the
popular favorite.

1:18:40.649 --> 1:18:44.039
If you were confident that the
ostracism would go your way,

1:18:44.036 --> 1:18:46.836
if you held an ostracism and
that wasn't true,

1:18:46.840 --> 1:18:50.170
you might find yourself
traveling a long way from home

1:18:50.165 --> 1:18:53.925
pretty soon, and so that's the
essence of ostracism and we'll

1:18:53.931 --> 1:18:57.821
have a look at it again because
it crops up and is used but not

1:18:57.821 --> 1:19:00.521
for twenty years after it's
invented.

1:19:00.520 --> 1:19:01.000
Okay.